From my experience, promotion is treated like a video game at work. You are an employee between 1-200 points. You start off at 1, and depending on years of service, extra work, dedication, smarts and skills you keep on adding points to your total Once you reach 201 points you're a manager!

Of course, nowhere during this time period were your prepared for the added responsibilities, so not you are in a sink of swim situation. If you are naturally talented in management (or happened to study some psychology, management or other related field) you may swim. Otherwise you sink and that's when things go bad both for you and your department.

Personally I don't care about promotions - don't feel like being tethered to the blackberry 24/7. If someone wants to acknowledge my contributions to my company there are other incentives such as more vacation time, added pay, flex time (etc - depending on your work environment). Promotion to management is not a "promotion" for each person involved.

Having been there and done that on both sides, I can certainly say that getting promoted is definitely a great deal less stressful than getting laid off.

@Adam | iHappy - "let's just leave it at fanciful dream... that if we cut back our work time to half or less, and got off the ambition-treadmill of seeking promotions and longer job titles, we'd be far better off at living life"

The problem is companies won't negotiate this kind of flexibility, in a horrible "take it or leave it situation". So then we are left to start our own company, but having a your own company needs just as many hours or more as a regular full-time job (Yes, some people have special skills developed through past employment that allows them to earn a living wage consulting on a reduced schedule, but they usually were highly paid with a somewhat rare skill set before the transition anyway). The reality is that most people skills and labor isn't worth all that much and employers know it. The basic employer attitude is (yes, there are exceptions):
"We are paying you more than anyone else will, so you have to take our crap or be unemplyed"

@JRandom42- Only if you are overextended, have no savings or investments and need a larger salary to get by month to month. Some educated, white collar, “employees” can actually survive on unemployment for long periods of time; and these people madden typical employers because the "stick or stick" routine isn't fully effective. People should choose the “management lifestyle” because they feel the benefits and disadvantages fit their lifestyle, if not then don’t take the promotions ever.

I think companies will need to change, especially if younger generations exiting college choose not to overextend themselves or start families once their student loans are paid off. It will be quite a reckoning for employers with aging staff, who cannot be replaced due to poor recruiting and retention policies for young candidates. There are many successful companies today that will survive the recession and the next boom, making good profit, increasing revenue, only to find that no one under 40 will work for them.

I think a lot of it depends on if you LIKE the industry and company you're working for in the first place. If you're working in an industry that excites you, then you'll relish the promotion and added responsibility. On the other hand, if it's just another step on the corporate ladder and you really don't have an horizon view of where you envision your career going, the added stress will have negative health consequences. I believe you just need to be really honest with yourself about what you really want and then plan a path to get there.

From my personal experience, when you get laid off without enough savings to get you through 6 months of no work, that just plain stinks.

> I think companies will need to change, especially if
> younger generations exiting college choose not to
> overextend themselves or start families once their
> student loans are paid off.

I suppose an entire generation could boycott life, just to prove a point. It would be an interesting experiment but the phrase, "cut off your nose to spite your face" comes to mind. Also, if the press is to be believed, the younger generation has already overextended themselves on student loans.

The new emphasis on volunteerism can be viewed as cultural rationalization, similar to sour grapes (aesops fable), but more positive. Is developing a meaningful philosophy of life simply rationalizing the choices you've already made?

Moving on....there are a few assumptions that need to be explored:

Assumption #1: employers are so desperate for employees they'll change their policies to adapt to the new generation.

What if businesses have done sufficient outsourcing and automation that they simply don't need many new people? The statistics (and my personal experience managing layoffs) show that younger employees are let go first because they are more easily replaced later. Perhaps replaced in 5 years by new college graduates from Generation Z, who are willing to work for companies GenY shuns.

Assumption #2: This is a "he"-cession from which traditionally female careers are exempt.

Maybe. But maybe there's just a delay in the system. When tax revenues decline and state budgets suffer, educators are let go. When people are unemployed, they can't afford daycare. Without employer-provided health insurance, spending on health care declines and nurses are laid off. Sure, federal deficit spending (fiscal stimulus) can ameliorate these trends, but the trends are there. Recessions are for everyone, eventually.

@60726x - "Also, if the press is to be believed, the younger generation has already overextended themselves on student loans"

Why are you referencing my statement out of context?

I SAID: "I think companies will need to change, especially if younger generations exiting college choose not to overextend themselves or start families once their student loans are paid off"

I think this current crisis will make young people rethink how much they spend on education and will make current borrows of student loans pay them off, only to be done with loans in general. If everyone stays in debt having babies then not much will change, this is an obvious point that doesn’t help your argument in any way. PLEASE ADDRESS MY COMMENTS AS STATED.

@60726x - "Perhaps replaced in 5 years by new college graduates from Generation Z, who are willing to work for companies GenY shuns"

Once again, out of context. I too have been involved in the layoff process and have found that laying off young workers today only delays the inevitable. Some industries cannot outsource all the work because of regulations, permits etc. Try designing and building a structure for a military base with outsourced staff overseas (It won't happen because of DOD background checks).

I also must add that boomers and older Xers will need to train younger people at some point. If you keep "booting" them out during every recession eventually you will have a major talent shortage in the less than 40 age group. Remember I am talking 10-15 years from now.

PLEASE ADDRESS MY COMMENT AS STATED.

So where are these Gen-Y leaders who are looking to advance their careers, assume more authority and responsibility, and be the drivers of change in business from within?

Or was that all a smokescreen, and that most of Gen-Y are more comfortable with being unemployed, instead of moving up to perhaps have a broader stage to show their skill, expertise, drive, and energy?

Tell you what, I'll take the promotion, the extra pay, the responsibility, the perks, and drive for change as I see it, and you can stay happy and unemployed. Works for me.

@JRandom42 - "Tell you what, I'll take the promotion, the extra pay, the responsibility, the perks, and drive for change as I see it, and you can stay happy and unemployed. Works for me"

It’s not an all or nothing situation. This situation is not as bleak as “take a promotion or be unemployed, nor is it “take a promotion get extra pay and perks”. Plus you keep avoiding that fact that you had some good breaks along your career path. Sure, it works for you, GREAT. Not everyone will have your opportunities, even if they follow all your "rules".

"instead of moving up to perhaps have a broader stage to show their skill, expertise, drive, and energy?"

Many careers are not a "stage" with an audience, they are "cells" with proxy authority figures watching a person’s every move (yes, there are exceptions but you have to be invited to the party!).

@JRandom42 - "All the world's a stage, And all the men and women merely players; They have their exits and their entrances,
And one man in his time plays many parts, His acts being seven ages."

First, thanks for acknowledging that "luck" plays a role in the process. Second, although Shakespeare was a knowledgeable man in his day, I don't buy into these types of anecdotes. They are nothing more than confidence boosters that don't have more than a baby toe dipped in reality. People that “buy” into the process of work love these types of quotes.

Don't assume that I am not successful in my career; it’s just that I was never interested in it and never got any chances to do interesting things, despite fighting, playing along, working hard, kissing butt etc. I tried it all and none of it worked EVER. Sure I get promotions and raises, but it’s still all the same crap and a general waste of time. It boils down to my beliefs not matching what is desired in the workforce. I really do have to "pretend" the whole time I am at work and its just exhausting and mostly pointless.

Yes, I have turned down promotions because taking them never effected whether I would get a raise or bonus. I still got my money, but none of the "management headaches". Would I have made more with the promotions? On paper yes, but in reality the extra hours would have reduced the overall pay hourly anyway. So its not much of a “raise” in the grand scheme of things

Work is dumb and promotions are dumb, I go to work because I need health insurance and have to build a retirement fund. If I didn't need those two things I could easily take a job that paid less with a 25-30 hour work weeks. Perhaps this is because of my “low income” background and all the “extra” crazy things I had to do to just to finish college (I have two Masters degree today). My family members knew “jack” about anything in the real world, so their opinions we always dowsed in fantasy. I was burnt before I even graduated and never had mentors or relevant guidence when I was young and impressionable. In the end, I could care less what employers want because they didn’t care to hire me or give me a chance until I was “educated”. The worst part is that the skills I use at work are not related to my degrees and are left over skills from the “grunt” jobs I had to take in order to survive and pay for school. So essentially I didn’t need to go to school to do my "career", but I needed school to get offered the job! What a waste of human intelligence and life.